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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)

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Ford authority.com isn't ford, so it's still speculation, no years are given, so it might go until the end of the current gen F150. but it wouldn't surprise me to see it go with everything moving away from diesel. It's sad because from an emissions standpoint, these are actually lower in CO2, NOx, and PM than the ecoboost engines, but the general consensus is that diesel is bad thanks to Volkswagen. I'm personally keeping mine forever, it's a perfect combo of efficiency and towing for me, and they're only getting more rare now! Scoop em while you can.
 

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I alluded to our F150 PSDs being sales unicorns when they were first rolled out -- now they have become owner unicorns with the engine possibly only being offered for ~2.5 model years. One redeeming value is that these are PowerStroke branded and come with a standard 5 yr/100K Engine Warranty. With COVID and my annual driving of 6-8K miles/year, kinda glad I went with the 8 yr/100K PremiumCare ESP, as I am hitting the 3 yr mark in a couple months. Let's hope the engine parts supply chain is sufficiently deep...
 

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I alluded to our F150 PSDs being sales unicorns when they were first rolled out -- now they have become owner unicorns with the engine possibly only being offered for ~2.5 model years. One redeeming value is that these are PowerStroke branded and come with a standard 5 yr/100K Engine Warranty. With COVID and my annual driving of 6-8K miles/year, kinda glad I went with the 8 yr/100K PremiumCare ESP, as I am hitting the 3 yr mark in a couple months. Let's hope the engine parts supply chain is sufficiently deep...
By law they have to supply parts for 10 years minimum. so we should be good for a long time yet.
 

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By law they have to supply parts for 10 years minimum. so we should be good for a long time yet.
Hopefully for the next 10 years they will do a better job on parts availability than they have for the last year or so. Of course, all makes and models suffer from parts shortages right now. I was looking at LKQ and it seems you can buy a 3.0 with low mileage for about $8,500.
 

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Hopefully for the next 10 years they will do a better job on parts availability than they have for the last year or so. Of course, all makes and models suffer from parts shortages right now. I was looking at LKQ and it seems you can buy a 3.0 with low mileage for about $8,500.
I couldn't convince my son to go with an F150 diesel - he said he didn't trust Ford to stick with it and instead got a RAM. Wonder if Ford's move is a shadow of others who will stick with the diesels only in their 2/3 series.
 

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I couldn't convince my son to go with an F150 diesel - he said he didn't trust Ford to stick with it and instead got a RAM. Wonder if Ford's move is a shadow of others who will stick with the diesels only in their 2/3 series.
I was sad to hear this. Tell your son to get his Ram tuned as soon as possible. Probably one of the Canadian tuners, as the EPA has castrated the best US tuners. My Ram has been great, because it was tuned at 5,000 miles, now 116,000 mi, no thanks to EPA. BTW, wouldn't be surprised if GM drops their 3L Duramax as well, would be too bad.
 

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It is hard to assign blame for the situation of diesels in the US. The manufacturers have all had huge failures such as the Ford 6.0 and the Navistar mess. Also the Maxxforce 13 issue that really gave diesels a bad name. Of course it began (in my opinion) with the Oldsmobile 350 that burned a huge number of buyers, including my very astute brother. You can't even mention diesels to him without a negative reaction. Most of these issues but not all point back to the excessive (in my opinion) requirements of the EPA.

Diesels in our types of vehicles have been used world wide with really good results. Mercedes cars are successful world wide. Fortunately Ford picked a nearly bullet proof engine for our trucks and beefed it up more for the US market. Almost all the issues we have had are with government mandated equipment and of course Ford and us are stuck with that. Still we can look at the mess at Ram as noted in this article:

The 3.0-L turbodiesel V6 “EcoDiesel” supplied by former Fiat affiliate VM Motori and made available optionally on the Ram 1500 light-duty truck and Jeep Grand Cherokee can fail relatively early in its service life. So much so that the Ram 1500 equipped with the EcoDiesel engine has been branded a lemon by the Automobile Protection Association and Lemon-Aid author Phil Edmonston.

The EcoDiesel has exhibited an unsettling number of main bearing failures, an event that can unfold while driving on the highway, which owners have described in vivid detail. One owner recounted one incident as “a catastrophic bottom end engine failure at highway speed, breaking the crankshaft and sending a connecting rod through the engine block.”

The EcoDiesel can fail with as little as 30,000 km on the odometer, owners claim. Fiat Chrysler is quietly laying the blame on the thin viscosity of the required 5W-30 engine oil, and it has changed the specification to SAE 5W-40 full synthetic oil to better protect engine components. The technical service bulletin applies to all existing 2014-16 models using the EcoDiesel engine.
Our F150s will always be known as trouble free diesels with issues with the EPA mandated changes. The buying public will always be nervous about "new" diesels and Ford spent little time or money letting the public know how rugged these machines are.
 

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TFLTruck also posted a video today on this topic:

Andrey claims he has a letter from Ford stating they are dropping this engine option. :(
 
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Lots of claims, nothing official from Ford so I'll withhold on believing this yet. And the Ram Ecodiesels issues weren't as widespread as the internet would have you believe- speaking from personal experience after putting 88,000 trouble-free miles on one.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I understand the hesitancy in these times of sketchy and lazy reporting, but the car and driver article says the news was confirmed by Ford. The Drive has also said they confirmed the news with Ford. So while there is a chance they are making it up I find that unlikely as this is not national security. I think the reports coupled with the cancellation of the planned diesel expedition a few years ago, JLR no longer using the motor in the Disco/phasing it out of the Range Rover, Ford’s refusal to actually market the motor, their green pivot, and falling sales (dropping over 10% from ‘19-‘20) makes me think it is, unfortunately, legit. Though I hope I am wrong.

Reports are saying July 16 is the last day to order the 3.0L.....:(

Ford F-150 Ditches Power Stroke Diesel V-6 Engine (caranddriver.com)
Ford F-150 Ditches Power Stroke Diesel Engine | The Drive

U.S. Vehicle Sales Dashboard | Diesel Technology Forum (dieselforum.org)
 

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By law they have to supply parts for 10 years minimum. so we should be good for a long time yet.
I didn't think this was true. They usually do but there is no requirement to do so. I could be mistaken, actually hope I am. I have a 2021 3.0 Powerstroke and am worried that was a mistake. With such a limited run, I wouldn't think there would be many parts even out there. Supply chain disruptions and COVID haven't helped. All in all, I was disappointed to hear the news. I am on hold with Ford at the moment to see if there is any other information though I doubt they will say much. Will update if they do mention anything to note.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I was sad to hear this. Tell your son to get his Ram tuned as soon as possible. Probably one of the Canadian tuners, as the EPA has castrated the best US tuners. My Ram has been great, because it was tuned at 5,000 miles, now 116,000 mi, no thanks to EPA. BTW, wouldn't be surprised if GM drops their 3L Duramax as well, would be too bad.
Good advice. I am not sure GM will drop their 3.0L so quickly. They spent a bunch of time developing the engine from the ground up, recently added it to the Yukon and Suburban lines, and actually sold almost twice as many 3.0L Diesel trucks in 2020 than Ford (if you add GMC and Chevrolet together) - Ford sold 24,532, GMC 16,762 and Chevrolet Silverado 29,407 or 46,169. Some of these numbers are undoubted impacted for both manufacturers by COVID and the chip shortage, but GM appears to be marketing their motor better and will likely see a boost in sales as those who would have bought the Ford and are not brand loyalists move to GM to get the Duramax.

U.S. Vehicle Sales Dashboard | Diesel Technology Forum (dieselforum.org)
 

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I didn't think this was true. They usually do but there is no requirement to do so. I could be mistaken, actually hope I am. I have a 2021 3.0 Powerstroke and am worried that was a mistake. With such a limited run, I wouldn't think there would be many parts even out there. Supply chain disruptions and COVID haven't helped. All in all, I was disappointed to hear the news. I am on hold with Ford at the moment to see if there is any other information though I doubt they will say much. Will update if they do mention anything to note.
You may be correct I don't think there's an actual law, and it's more just heresay from random internet people. That said as long as there is a market for parts, they will still get produced, so i wouldn't be worried about running out of filters or belts or anything like that. As long as dealerships are servicing them the main parts should be around. JLR is still using them on the range rover, so hopefully that continues and we can source any odd parts through there. I definitely don't think you made a mistake, as you now have an ultra-rare brand new truck. Your warranty will still be good for the 5 years, so take comfort in that. If something critical breaks, and ford cant fix it.. well.. that's on them and not you, although i don't see that being a thing. These are great little engines, so be happy you got one! if my 18 wasn't still just as good as the day i bought it, I would be putting an order in for a new one myself before the deadline. The new trim with this engine would be awesome.. and now you will be one of the few lucky enough to have one.
 

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Good advice. I am not sure GM will drop their 3.0L so quickly. They spent a bunch of time developing the engine from the ground up, recently added it to the Yukon and Suburban lines, and actually sold almost twice as many 3.0L Diesel trucks in 2020 than Ford (if you add GMC and Chevrolet together) - Ford sold 24,532, GMC 16,762 and Chevrolet Silverado 29,407 or 46,169. Some of these numbers are undoubted impacted for both manufacturers by COVID and the chip shortage, but GM appears to be marketing their motor better and will likely see a boost in sales as those who would have bought the Ford and are not brand loyalists move to GM to get the Duramax.

U.S. Vehicle Sales Dashboard | Diesel Technology Forum (dieselforum.org)
You're right, I suspect the GM engine will have a minimum 10 year run if not more until electric can really make a dent. They invested so much into this, and they do seem to be advertising it more as you say. It's also more reasonably priced compared to the fords. I have always been a ford fan, but would likely be one to cross the line over to GM now for my next truck... Although that may not be for a while yet... but i'll go where the diesel is. You just can't compete with the efficiency of them, and I have no need for an HD.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
You may be correct I don't think there's an actual law, and it's more just heresay from random internet people. That said as long as there is a market for parts, they will still get produced, so i wouldn't be worried about running out of filters or belts or anything like that. As long as dealerships are servicing them the main parts should be around. JLR is still using them on the range rover, so hopefully that continues and we can source any odd parts through there. I definitely don't think you made a mistake, as you now have an ultra-rare brand new truck. Your warranty will still be good for the 5 years, so take comfort in that. If something critical breaks, and ford cant fix it.. well.. that's on them and not you, although i don't see that being a thing. These are great little engines, so be happy you got one! if my 18 wasn't still just as good as the day i bought it, I would be putting an order in for a new one myself before the deadline. The new trim with this engine would be awesome.. and now you will be one of the few lucky enough to have one.
I agree with all but the part where you say JLR is still using them. JLR has started to phase out this motor which is one of the reasons I think Ford is as well. The last year you could get the 3.0L in the Discovery in the states was for the 2020 year. In 2021 you could still get the motor in the full size Range Rover...but I went to the site to look at 2022 models and couldn't find one with the 3.0L engine, doesn't mean they won't add it later, but right now it is not listed. This makes sense as they JLR shifts to their new straight-six InGenium mild hybrid Diesel. The mild hybrid sounds a lot like Ram's e-torque motor line.

Ingenium engine family - Wikipedia

That being said, I think there are enough of the F-150s and JLRs with the power plant currently in circulation that I am not overly concerned about parts for the next decade or so.

 
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I agree with all but the part where you say JLR is still using them. JLR has started to phase out this motor which is one of the reasons I think Ford is as well. The last year you could get the 3.0L in the Discovery in the states was for the 2020 year. In 2021 you could still get the motor in the full size Range Rover...but I went to the site to look at 2022 models and couldn't find one with the 3.0L engine, doesn't mean they won't add it later, but right now it is not listed. This makes sense as they JLR shifts to their new straight-six InGenium mild hybrid Diesel. The mild hybrid sounds a lot like Ram's e-torque motor line.

Ingenium engine family - Wikipedia

That being said, I think there are enough of the F-150s and JLRs with the power plant currently in circulation that I am not overly concerned about parts for the next decade or so.
Not in the US, but the engine is still being used in a few models in Europe in 2022 and hopefully beyond. Most of the Euro manufacturers, bmw, Mercedes, VW, etc have pulled their diesels from the US market, looks like JLR is following suit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Not in the US, but the engine is still being used in a few models in Europe in 2022 and hopefully beyond. Most of the Euro manufacturers, bmw, Mercedes, VW, etc have pulled their diesels from the US market, looks like JLR is following suit.
Yup, getting harder and harder to find in the U.S. For what it is worth the Wiki page I linked to above already shows the Ingenium inline 4 and 6 diesels as the primary JLR diesels with the 3.0L lion motor as their predecessor....so it looks as though if JLR is keeping the diesels in any market they will be using their own motors. Keep an eye on the plant numbers for Ford's Dagenham motor plant where the 3.0L is made....that will show if the motor is still in use with any manufacturer.
 

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My other vehicle is a 1998 Subaru Outback. Paid $500 for it, use for short trips and plan to drive in the salt this winter. A lady came up to me at the post office today and said: " Must be a lot cheaper to drive than that huge Ram!" Nope, I told her, it gets 25 mpg, my Ram has 116,000 trouble free miles and is getting over 32 mpg. I know folks think we are full of $hit, but diesels are about as "green" as you can get! I have gotten around 20 mpg towing a 10,000 lb boat behind my Ecodiesel , effortlessly! I will hang on to my Ecodiesel, I guess! Can't justify a 2500 Powerstroke or CTD, and I really don't like the GMs , Nissans or Tundras.
 

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As much as I have liked all my fords this will probably be my last. I have owned 16 Fords including 3 - F150's but have a difficult time supporting a company that abandons a line in 3 years without ever supporting the product.
 
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