[jmperlik]

Hi guys - I stopped by my dealer this week because I found that they did not fill my DEF (as requested) with my first oil change service at 5000 miles. My Service Advisor apologized and told me that the Ford Service system did not bring DEF refills up automatically for 5K intervals, so he added a manual note so this would not happen the next time. He thinks because the F150 Diesel is still new, that Ford is still working out all the kinks in their service processes. This wasn't a huge deal because the DEF indicator (which was up on my gauge display!) still had ~1000 miles to go so I was nowhere near running out.

Tip: If you are having your Ford dealership's Service department fill your DEF, you must request that it needs to be done at 5K intervals, until Ford sorts out the issue in their Service system.

While they were filling up my DEF tank, I questioned my Service Manager again on why I only made it to 5000 mile on the factory engine oil. He kinda gave me the same answers he gave me previously about the 12 month time limit and when my truck was built, etc. Like I mentioned before, I really don't have a good explanation for why I only made it to 4,900 miles on the factory engine oil.

I then challenged him on the 7,500 to 10,000 mile "Normal" driving conditions listed in the chart in the F150 Owners manual (attached below) and an interesting discussion ensued regarding what is "Normal" -- he thinks the word "Normal" should be replaced with the word "Ideal" in this discussion.

His definition of "Ideal" driving conditions fall into this narrow band:

1. Primarily highway driving; e.g. not a lot of stop-and-go city traffic
2. No mountainess or hilly driving conditions
3. No towing of any kind
4. No extreme heat or extreme cold parts of the country
   
   + Tight temperature range of 30-40 degree weather conditions
   + He specifically called out Southeastern states as examples​

After hearing his definition, I think that "Normal" is not the mean or average for most of us, which is why I thought it was important to start this thread, as most of us probably think our driving habits as "Normal." He didn't feel that where I am in the Mid-Hudson Valley region of New York fell into this Normal/Ideal driving conditions and why he recommended a 5K Oil Change interval.

Also note that the chart below is from the generic F150 Owners manual; i.e. there is no "Diesel" supplement of the F150 Owners manual like there is for the F150 Raptor Supplement

In addition, there is not a separate/unique Oil Change Interval chart for the 3.0L Diesel engine in the generic F150 Owners manual, so I guess we are all supposed to use this single chart for both gasoline & diesel engine options? This does not seem right to me because there are fundamental differences between gasoline and diesel engines that necessitate changing the oil in a diesel engine on a shorter interval/cycle.

At no time during this entire 15 minute discussion did my Service Manager use the term "Normal" -- he kept using the term "Ideal" instead of "Normal"

He also questioned why anyone would pay north of $60K for a F150 Diesel (including the $3K engine upcharge!) and then try to stick with the 7,500-10,000 mile range listed in the F150 Owners manual. Is the $$$ savings on 7-8 oil changes really worth the cost of the engine and vehicle?

Based on all of the above, I now understand why he recommended a 5K Oil Change Interval when I asked what I should be doing for my Extended Maintenance ESP. Was he "upselling" me to generate more revenue for Ford? Maybe, but his points above ring true and make a lot of sense to me.

I understand that this post may be controversial, but I think having engaging discussions is what these forums are all about.

Thoughts? Would especially like to hear from current/previous SuperDuty Diesel owners on the concept of a 10K oil change interval...

 

[Dunrollin]

I change my own and it will be early but I am not even to 1,000 mi yet. I did get a new filter already but still have not decided which oil to use. I really want full synthetic but waiting for now.

My 2013 F150 with a 5.0 has over 100,000 miles and uses very little oil. I want this one to do the same.

 

[jmperlik]

While researching the infamous WSS-M2C214-B1 oil specification, I came across this document: Ford Power Stroke Diesel Filter & Oil Reference Sheet on the Ford-approved Official Site for Ford Power Stroke Diesel

Some things I noticed when inspecting:

• This Reference Sheet was last updated December 2018 (according to date in lower left-hand corner of last page) = current information
• F150 Diesel oil (WSS-M2C214-B1 Specification) is included in the lower right-hand of Page 2
• "3.0L F150" engine is included in all of the Air/Fuel/Oil filter tables along the right-hand side of Page 3
• PowerStroke Diesel F-150 & Transit Connect (3.0L, 1.5L) SAE Viscosity Grades/Operating Temperature chart is included in lower left-hand corner of Page 3
• Ford Maintenance Schedule tables on page 4 have not been updated with the 3.0L PowerStroke "Lion" Engine

I see one engine type (6.4L => 2008-2010) with a 10K Oil change interval for "Normal Maintenance Schedule" and along with the latest 6.7L (2011-present) available in the SuperDutys w/Oil Minder (Check Message Center), so it does look like they have been moving to a 10K Oil Change interval for their diesel engines in the past 10 years for a "Normal Maintenance Schedule"

I have already paid for my Extended Maintenance ESP with 5K Oil Change intervals so my decision has already been made, but I thought other owners on the forum might be interested in this handy Diesel Filter and Oil Reference sheet.

 

[jamanrr]

honestly we have a guage for air filter replacement and oil change interverals. I would follow what the digital read out states, and also since the original auto makers add moly and other additives to the orginal oil in the engine thus I would not change it till the recommend first change interveral. These are modern computer made engines with super exact tolerances. I plan on keeping some extra DEF around and changing the oil when the computer recommends. If you have a plan then get it changed at will. A gas burner should be chnaged every 5 thousand miles because gas is a solvent -- diesel is oil based and thus provides more lubrication to all essential parts including fuel pump and engine internals. I would have no problem changing the oil as the truck computer told me too.

 

[Vb150]

I have a 2020 and my first oil change was at 17% 3500 miles.The truck was made 7/20 build date. That was back in November since I have put another 1300 miles on it and oil life is down to 60 percent any idea why the truck is calling for these low mileage oil changes

 

[jmperlik]

What is your typical driving style/cycle? Based on my experiences, I am going to guess primarily city driving with trips less than 20 minutes, as you seem to be tracking close to what I was on my first oil change. If so, I will point you to another thread where we figured out why Oil life was so short for some owners (including me)...

 

[Vb150]

Yes almost all city I work 5 miles from home

 

[jmperlik]

@Vb150 - simply put: your short oil change interval is due to your short drive cycles = with 5 minute drives, your truck never gets up to operating conditions where Active Regens can occur and if it does, you are not driving it long enough to completely clear out your DPF (Diesel Particulate Filter)

Check out this thread with a not-so-obvious title: Stuck in regen???

It is a very long read, but it documents chronologically how we determined that short drive cycles lead to the "DPF Death Spiral" condition due to Ford not exposing DPF % Full in your IPC (Instrument Panel Cluster) and your never getting a full cleaning of your DPF (Diesel Particulate Filter) due to aborted regen cycle = once your truck enters Active Regen, you must drive for 15-20 minutes uninterrupted to thoroughly "clean" your DPF back down to 0% Full. The problem lies in you, as an owner, don't know how full your DPF is or when you are in an Active Regen cycle...

I strongly recommend that you purchase an OBDii adapter + FORScan software to enable DPF % Full, so you can determine when your truck is in Active Regen: START HERE: New FORScan user education

Any questions after reading up on these topics, ask back here or feel free to PM me....

 

[Vb150]

Thanks so much for help will keep you posted

 

[hydrex]

You might check if the dealer could enable a screen on your display to tell you regen status. My Ram Ecodiesel shows( DPF 80% full drive at highway speeds) After around 5-7 miles it drops to 70%, 60% until (regen is finished) Takes about 10 miles. Was suggesting to my brother who has an F250 PS diesel that he might be able to get dealer to flash that into his ecm, as he has had to get it towed in twice. He solved by deleting and tuning... Anyway GDE was able to give me that screen, so it is in there somewhere. The FORScan sounds like a good solution, though.